Grrr..... just gotta vent, comp problems

[Dweller_Benthos]

So, Wednesday I turn on my comp (the new one I posted pics of in the other thread) and I get a Windows update. Fine, I think, let it go, needs to reboot.....

That was last time it worked.....

I notice it seems to be booting slow, weird, I think. Then, nothing, then:

NTLDR not found press CTRL-ALT-DEL to reboot

uh oh...... that can never be good. FOUR HOURS LATER, I've disconnected every drive & peripheral except keyboard, mouse and the boot drive, been to the BIOS settings a bunch of times, and gotten it to boot once or twice, but never fully load windows normally. I give up and go to bed.

Last night, I start it up and the same thing, it tries to load windows, but usually never does or eventually gets to a diagnostic screen where it tries to figure it out and fix it. Tried restoring to the last check point, did disc scans which found a troubling amount of scary sounding errors, but still nothing.

Finally put in the install CD and let it install a new copy of windows. Takes forever, but it eventually sorta works. I get to a desktop and start looking at the drive. Everything seems to be there, and the comp runs, but it's crippled because most of the drivers aren't installed for the chipsets on the mobo. I start installing those, and get to the raid controller which installs OK it seems. Needs a reboot.....

Guess what? Windows cannot start and can't find a solution to the problem. Just great. I'm thinking the raid controller went belly up and as long as it's running in dumb slow mode it's fine, but once it tries to kick into a higher speed mode, it dies.

Saturday I'm calling tech support to see what my options are, I'm still under warranty, so I should be OK, but I'm going to be without the computer for a while, I'm sure. Luckily, I still have my old computer because I was too lazy to format it and sell it, so there's a good thing in procrastinating I guess.

Guess I should have made a backup, but I never figured a solid state drive on a brand new computer to have problems, but no one expects the Spanish Inquisition, do they?

[Binnatics]

I googled the line you qouted. That learned me that this NTLDR is a file that exists in the root folder. Due to "copying loads of files to the root folder" or "having the folder too much fragmented" it may get lost.
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/320397
I can't imagine that has happened on your system, (it's brand new!!) especially because you allready did a clean install. So that would mean, in my opinion, that your SSD drive is corrupted or damaged.
I know just as many about SSD disks and their reliability as I know about the Spanish Inquisition so I guess you're right to check the hardware store. You could try to install a clean windows on an old disk to be sure, but that's a lot of w@&k. Better let them test the system.

Damn bad luck man! I really hope contacting the store will solve the problem. Keep us posted. I was just planning on buying a SSD disk myself, in the near future :-\\

[PZ]

Sounds like a bad problem, D_B.  I know little to nothing about SSDs so I can't be of much help.  I suppose they w@&k on a similar method of sectors and such - did you do a chkdsk/f to try to fix any potential sector errors?

I'm totally guessing here.

[Art Blade]

Whoa. First off, good luck solving that, D_B.

Whatever it is, we know your system used to w%&k. Means something changed (broke). With your description I too think the RAID controller is affected. Doesn't have to be hardware failure, though.

You could try a different raid option (simply put, don't use RAID). Changing that requires BIOS setting changes and/or new drivers and more than probably a new windows installation. If you're lucky, it's just a matter of changing the driver.

Keep us posted, mate

[Binnatics]

Is there any RAID config required for using SSD disk??
I thought it was plug and play, just like regular diskdrives.

[PZ]

For a home configuration, I personally would not use a RAID for the boot drive - only for the program and data files.  On an aside, as part of the RAID - you have all SSDs as part of the array or are they mixed with standard drives?

[Dweller_Benthos]

Thanks for the replies, here's what the tech guy said. Since I have a bunch of external hard drives in USB, Firewire and eSATA, it's best to turn off USB legacy support in the BIOS. He said that's pretty much for older keyboards and stuff that any modern system won't have to worry about. It can also cause problems with new USB stuff, so it's best to turn it off if you don't think you need it.

As for the raid controller, he said to change it to AHCI mode for windows 7, again, more compatibility and if you don't need RAID, why bother? It was on RAID mode from the factory, so I figured they had it in the mode it should be in for that system, but I guess not.

I had already reloaded windows and because of the several failed reboots, it did an extensive check of the drive and found a bunch of scary sounding errors that it apparently fixed. Seems that maybe some of my MP3 files were effected and maybe the thumbnail cache for adobe bridge, both of which I really don't care about. What I did care about, was after I reloaded windows, I was essentially back at square one and have to load all my software again. I probably shouldn't have installed a new copy of windows so fast, but tried other things first.

His theory as to the cause was when I was using my external USB drive, it stopped responding (which they always did for some reason, even on my old XP system) and somehow caused an error and corrupted the master boot record of the boot drive. That was why it wasn't finding the drive to begin with and why it was giving the NTLDR error, since it couldn't find a boot drive, it was looking at my other drives which aren't bootable and giving up. I have it back running again, and it ran all day yesterday downloading updates and drivers so I think it may be OK, but I'm going to call tech support again tonight, see if they have any other hints, the guy I talked to Saturday said there are utilities & diagnostics to run that will test the drive and controller and see if there are any potential problems. If so, my choices are sending it back or getting parts to swap out myself, which is what I would go for, the shipping on that thing would be killer, it must weigh close to 50 pounds.

[Binnatics]

Sounds complicated. Glad your problems seem fixed now ;) :-X

[PZ]

The explanation sounds reasonable - I have two USB ports on my home PC that act funny - if I plug in a thumb drive then my keyboard and mouse go dead.  However, if I have the thumb drive in from the start, everything works fine.  Interestingly, this occurs only with two of the four front USB ports, and all are plugged into the same bus.

[Dweller_Benthos]

Yeah, that sounds about the same problem, I have two USB hubs, a bunch of stuff plugged into each, but not always turned on. The battery backup is always plugged in and on, of course, but when I turn on a hard drive, it sometimes loses the battery, says it can't find it. Rebooting sometimes helps, sometimes not. Last night I couldn't get an external hard drive to w@&k at all unless it was directly plugged into the computer. So, I've ordered two new hubs that are hopefully a bit better, not that the old ones were el cheapo. But since I have USB 3 now, I figured I might as well get a USB 3 hub to go with it.

Seems to be working OK now, but on one reboot last night it took a while to come back to windows and I was starting to get a little nervous, but it eventually came back.

[PZ]

Good luck with it D_B; new computers shouldn't cause us problems like this.

[Art Blade]

That AHCI mode was a problem I had to identify and fix on my own when I wanted to install XP on this system (originally set up with Vista home premium but I lovingly kissed it good-bye after the first system start). XP wouldn't even boot from its installation disk. That's when I started to push all kinds of BIOS-buttons and eventually happened upon said AHCI mode. With that settled, XP installed properly and later my dual-boot system with W7 was just a walk in the park. That legacy support thing was something else I kissed good-bye as I too thought, why bother.

Good luck with your system, D_B.. once you've sorted all that crap out, it sure will be a monster to be proud of :)

[Dweller_Benthos]

Thanks. I'm slowly getting it back to where it was a week ago. Still need to install tons of software, and I called tech support last night to get their final thoughts, and they said they'd e-mail the original guy and have him call me back since he knew better what was going on.

At this point, it seems to be working, except for the USB hub issue, which I can only blame on the hubs, since they were sorta flaky even on my old XP system, but never to the point of corrupting something. They were decent d-link 7 port hubs too, about $35 a piece, so not some cheap crap for $10.

[deadman1]

Thanks. I'm slowly getting it back to where it was a week ago. Still need to install tons of software, and I called tech support last night to get their final thoughts, and they said they'd e-mail the original guy and have him call me back since he knew better what was going on.

At this point, it seems to be working, except for the USB hub issue, which I can only blame on the hubs, since they were sorta flaky even on my old XP system, but never to the point of corrupting something. They were decent d-link 7 port hubs too, about $35 a piece, so not some cheap crap for $10.

Just had a thought (I know it scared the crap out of me too  :-()) but just how many things do you have conected to those USB hubs? The problem you might be caused by the fact that the USB ports on you computer are not able to supply the correct amount of power to those devices. I think that the typical USB port can sypply a maximum of 500 mA per internal hub, so if your external hubs have their own powersupply you should probably try and use that.

[Dweller_Benthos]

The hubs are self-powered, I learned long ago not to use unpowered hubs. Plus, the hard drives plugged into them have their own power supplies as well. I don't know if it's just that the hubs are older and aren't 100% compatible with win 7, or the fact I had the controller set to raid instead of AHCI, or gremlins, who knows?

We'll see what happens once my new hubs arrive.

[Binnatics]

Good luck on the hub-issue. Did they act weird from the start with your new rig? Or later on?
I've had that powersupply issue once Deadman mentioned. Well, my father actually. It was an expternal harddisk without powersupply of its own. A 3,5 inch.
It was working fine allways, until I bought him a new system. Then, sometimes, it didn't w@&k. But sometimes it did w@&k properly, without any hasitation, weird. The disk cam with a cable to plug it into 2 usb connectors for extra power supply. Don't remember if that made any difference.  :-\\

[Dweller_Benthos]

Those hubs of mine were always flaky, never seemed to w@&k right, even on my old XP system, though they were less trouble, I would need to reboot, as the system wouldn't find the drive if I just turned it on. With the win 7 system, it would find the drive at power on, but I would be browsing files and all of a sudden it would say the folder is no longer available, has been deleted or moved, etc. Then, if I was copying files to the external, it would all of sudden stop and say it can't find the drive anymore, or, say the drive was unformatted, do I want to format it? Don't think so. Usually, a reboot with the drive turned on would fix that, but that gets old.

The new hubs arrived, and of course, the cable that came with the USB 3.0 hub is only about 3 feet long so I have to order a new one that's 6 feet. I haven't had a chance to hook them up as I've been sick all this week. Stupid head cold. Just what I need after seeing that move "Contagion" last Sunday. That's enough to make you never leave your house again. So hopefully this weekend I will have recovered enough to mess around with it.

[Binnatics]

Good luck D_B, hope you get better!
Never heard someone having so many problems with USB drives. Weird s#!t.

[Art Blade]

D_B, reboot yourself and serve your PC some hot tea with honey :-D

Get better, both of you  :-()

[fragger]

lol Art :-D

Hope you get well soon, D_B :)

[Dweller_Benthos]

Feeling better now, thanks guys.

As for the computer, after spending most of my free time this weekend messing around with the USB issue, I've come to the conclusion that it just doesn't like the old style USB 2.0 hubs. I bought a new one that worked only after I replaced the cable, though only to recognize the drives, it couldn't actually read data off them. And the printer I had plugged into it would recognize & load drivers, but couldn't actaully print. So I took the one USB 3.0 hub I had and hooked it up temporary with the short cable it comes with and guess what? Everything works. Go figure. At least I copied files to & from the drive, watched some videos that were on the other drive, and printed some stuff on the printer and they all worked.

A really strange thing happened while I was fooling with the printer on the old hub. I'd plug the printer in and it would appear in the printers folder, then the action center or whatever it's called would pop up and say that some things have stopped working and I need to install new drivers for them. One being the USB controller, the other being power management (?????) and the third being my hard drive controller. Go figure, I'm completely stumped. Why the heck does plugging a printer into a USB hub make the hard driver controller no longer w@&k? Probably just a driver conflict, but really?

Moral of the story: If you have windows 7 and USB 3.0, and are having problems with old standard USB 2.0 hubs or devices, get a USB 3.0 hub and hopefully it will fix the problem.

[Art Blade]

Nice. :) :-X

Yeah, yeah.. PCs acting up for reasons unknown to the average guy and beyond comprehension for the specialists just serve as a proof of concept: personal computers are not common computers. They are individual and may be just as screwed-up as any other individual for no apparent reason ^+-+

[Binnatics]

 ^+-+

I have a personal computer too ^-^
I think I should drag him over to a therapist, he's getting on my nerves :-D

[Art Blade]

You may even go as far as killing it without having to fear legal consequences. :-()

[Dweller_Benthos]

You may even go as far as killing it without having to fear legal consequences. :-()

Believe me, the thought had occurred................